Why is New Jersey cracking down on bowling league 50/50s?

[BubbaRay]

by kheyboer April 20, 2009 13:07PM


State officials have recently begun informing local bowling leagues they can not run 50/ 50 fundraisers without a license.
Seems the state of New Jersey has nothing better to do in this so-called budget crisis than to chase after bowling leagues that run 50/ 50s, have little fun card games and the sort.

Our Friday night league was just informed this past week that anyone found in violation of engaging in the extracurricular activities mentioned above would be asked to leave the establishment permanently. This is because the establishment could face stiff penalties from the state.

These 50/ 50s, card games, etc., have been run in fun for years and years and just an accepted pleasure of league bowling. It's basically at the same level as having a family card game at home for nickels and dimes over a couple of beers.


Is it against same law? Yep . . . Right up there with not being allowed to fly a kite in Newark.

But the same New Jersey state agency didn't go all the way, did it? Isn't bowling for league prize money also part of whatever asinine policy this ridiculous agency is trying to pursue? So not only should all 50/ 50s and card game monies be halted immediately, but shouldn't every ongoing, competitive league too?

For that matter, shouldn't all bowling tournaments, including PBA ones be terminated as well? After all, it's all about some sort of wagering, isn't it? Not only myself, but I'm sure a whole bunch of other bowling enthusiasts would love to know who in this wonderful state is responsible for instigating such a ridiculous crusade.

Whoever that is definitely has way too much time on his/ her hands for our budget-stretched state to justify their position and wasting of our tax dollars. That person now needs to become part of the unemployment problem of our state and that position eliminated in order to save taxpayers some of our hard earned tax donations.

James Fossati lives in Jackson.

[Chicarpenter84]

That is some crap. I can't believe there going to go around and find the center if they find people doing any of that and then the center having to kick them out for doing such things.

It really makes you think what other states might start to follow this or what's next. That simple card game could piss a lot of bowlers off and just say forget league or really cut down on there bowling time. It will be interesting to see if there's a decease of league size's next season or not.

[BubbaRay]

That is some crap. I can't believe there going to go around and find the center if they find people doing any of that and then the center having to kick them out for doing such things.

It really makes you think what other states might start to follow this or what's next. That simple card game could piss a lot of bowlers off and just say forget league or really cut down on there bowling time. It will be interesting to see if there's a decease of league size's next season or not.

Makes you want to send a letter to them and say if this is the game we are going to play, then all the local Picnics with their games of chance should be cut off also. And some of the fairs and picnics games of chance benefit their local Fire and Police department. Maybe their tune will be changed.

[Harris]

In one of my local houses the manager will kick you out for pot bowling because they consider it illegal gambling, however on league nights the same manager has no issues with anyone playing 5 card on marks for a pot which makes no sense to me but whatever. The house also in a way sponsors singles and doubles pots on another league night that is not run by the house but they know about it and announce the winners over the intercom after each game which is still considered gambling in my opinion. I totally disagree with New Jersey and think it's very stupid what they're doing and completely agree with the writer of the article. I'm 110% on the side of where do these legislative bodies find time to deal with stuff like this but we have people on death row for 30 years that our tax dollars are feeding, educating, and whatever else they want as long as they exhibit "good behavior" the whole system is a crock to me, if only they had alley's on remote islands....... :D

[pkrplayer]

I also think the article is ignorant.

I noticed that the author said that they should also pursue the leagues themselves for people putting up money each week in hopes to get some of it back in the future. Then they should go after tournaments and then the PBA. I know they were just being sarcastic, but if by chance they were to do that, where would it end? Bowling is no different than any other sport where you pay an entry fee and compete against other players who paid a fee and try to win money back. Golf and tennis spring to mind. Hypothetically speaking, when they shut down the PBA for "gambling" will they then go after tennis and possibly Tiger Woods and the PGA? I don't think so. As far as the cards and pot games are concerned, wouldn't that be similar to a skins match in golf? It just isn't sponsored by an independent company.

[Lonewolf300800]

all the leagues i bowl on do the 50/50 drawings, the winner gets half and the other half goes into the league prize fund to be distributed evenly between all the teams in the league.

[BubbaRay]

The leagues I bowlin also run 50/50 tickets but here in PA. they announce the winning ticket number lane by lane. In PA it is illegal to announce a winning 50/50 ticket number over the intercome system because of this exact same ruling.

geee! A thought just came to my mind. What about the houses that run a progressive strike jack pot ? I wonder if they will close down or arrest the owners for doing that. That would be considered gambling also right? But Noooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!! they can get away with it. It is us people that suffer.

[VmsTopGun]

every bowling alley in NJ was fined 3000USD for illegal gambling. The state has since had it's eyes open and returned the fines. NJ is in bad shape, make me wonder why my wife wants to live here, I'd be in Texas if I had anything to say...

I'll gathter a detailed list of whats accepted and whats not friday night and report back.

[Thepainscoming]

I HATE THIS STATE SO MUCH. thats why im trying to do everything possible to GET OUT OF HERE for college. its a waste of space IMO.

[Spare Time Proshop]

all the leagues i bowl on do the 50/50 drawings, the winner gets half and the other half goes into the league prize fund to be distributed evenly between all the teams in the league.

The state of Ind started this law in July of 2008....But we have found away around it we no long have 50/50 drawing where it is winner by chance......... its a skill shot..... if you get called you have to get more that 6 pins in two shots...If not all the money goes in to the prize fund.......Now it not luck but skill.......

The state of Ind has put a stop to card games like house game texas holdem or any form of poker the state said its luck not skill......

[tyketto]

all the leagues i bowl on do the 50/50 drawings, the winner gets half and the other half goes into the league prize fund to be distributed evenly between all the teams in the league.

I'd hate to be in NJ for this..

In leagues I grew up in, 50/50 drawings had the winner get half, and the other goes to funding the university collegiate team for travel to tournaments. In this case, it would be a non-profit getting the other half. If they call that gambling, or illegal, they have way too much time on their hands and need to look at their own practices to see what is illegal or not.

BL.

[PABowler]

The leagues I bowlin also run 50/50 tickets but here in PA. they announce the winning ticket number lane by lane. In PA it is illegal to announce a winning 50/50 ticket number over the intercome system because of this exact same ruling.

geee! A thought just came to my mind. What about the houses that run a progressive strike jack pot ? I wonder if they will close down or arrest the owners for doing that. That would be considered gambling also right? But Noooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!! they can get away with it. It is us people that suffer.

I also bowl here in PA and all our 50/50 drawings are done from the intercom.

[Cobberz]

hopefully the world does end in 2012 because by that time were not going to be able to have any fun, or do anything good for anyone. The government is a joke in NY and seems like its getting that way everywhere else too. Online Poker going down the drain and now no fun bowling? whats this world coming to?

[BubbaRay]

I also bowl here in PA and all our 50/50 drawings are done from the intercom.

I know we were told in the Scranton area, that it was illegal to announce the 50/50 drawing over the intercom. I wonder if it could be a local ordinance in our area PaBowler.

[idlehourlegend]

I know we were told in the Scranton area, that it was illegal to announce the 50/50 drawing over the intercom. I wonder if it could be a local ordinance in our area PaBowler.

Greenridge does it over the intercom, although there closing anyway so dont really think they care.

[PABowler]

Could be a local ordiance. Or it just just be a Center ordiance. No idea, im going to start digging through some local/state legislative on it. I am in the Berks County Area.

[Chicarpenter84]

We don't do 50-50 by us its strike pot you by ticket's and they will call the winning ticket over the intercom if it's yours you go show them it and are told to bowl on lane 16. If you strike you win the money if you don't money carries over to next week. Last Friday it had to be cleared for the last night it was hit for $1600 and then last year I hit it for my team for $2100 and my buddy hit it for him and his dad for $3500.

Also you or anyone else are not allowed to bowl on 16 before league and they will mess the lane up every week by slicking it all the way down/ strip it your best shot always is hard fast at the pocket.

I don't see how much different that is from 50-50 your taking a chance at getting a ticket called and getting a strike if your called.

Illinois will soon follow this they do everything else already. I'm just waiting for that day they tell me I can't drive on the left lane since they wanted to make that the GREEN LANE.

I will have to find some info on it for IL since I never seen a bowling alley here run 50-50 they all do Strike Pot for each league and some do the house Strike Pot with having to strike in the frames they have listed in each game in order to clear the pot.

If its not ran by the State it's all illegal to them. I really like to no how these people get these job's. Who makes up these job's for people to go out and find something to cry about like they don't take enough money from all us already. There going to cry over a $10 card game. I'd like to meet some of them and tell them what I think they can go do.

[butch444444]

So far in Virginia they still allow 50/50, but the counter people will no longer draw the tickets as they say they have been warned that it could incriminate the lanes? I reported earlier on here that Virginia had made a ruling that card playing during league bowling was illegal, and I fully expect the 50/50s to be declared that way soon. Can jackpots or shoot out boards be far behind?

[tyketto]

So far in Virginia they still allow 50/50, but the counter people will no longer draw the tickets as they say they have been warned that it could incriminate the lanes? I reported earlier on here that Virginia had made a ruling that card playing during league bowling was illegal, and I fully expect the 50/50s to be declared that way soon. Can jackpots or shoot out boards be far behind?

My houses don't let the staff draw the number either, but still has 50/50 drawings.
I doubt that, because there is no established law declaring that illegal that wouldn't be too broad. If that were the case, any betting (I bet you $5 you can't pick up the 6-7-10) would be illegal, no matter where you do it at.

I wouldn't be surprised if some of these laws show up at dumblaws.com anytime soon.

BL.

[Lightning1]

Live in NY, bowl in both NJ and NY

bunch of crapola we are facing in both states...

NJ with the enforcement of the anti-gambling laws and NY with the proposed taxation of bowling fees.

You can rest assured this is 100% response to the economic crisis hitting this country. The problem is that they are taking this crisis out on people that want to enjoy an evening with their family and friends doing something they love...

Next thing you know, they'll find some way to tax the air we breath...

[DSOTM]

"Live in NY, bowl in both NJ and NY

bunch of crapola we are facing in both states...

NJ with the enforcement of the anti-gambling laws and NY with the proposed taxation of bowling fees.

You can rest assured this is 100% response to the economic crisis hitting this country. The problem is that they are taking this crisis out on people that want to enjoy an evening with their family and friends doing something they love...

Next thing you know, they'll find some way to tax the air we breath...
Yesterday 07:33 PM
"

-Same here. NJ and NY are in serious trouble right now. Both states are currently being run into the ground by incompetents. (NY especially, our governer is incompetent, at best). Realistically, the state govt's are going to see pennies from the crackdown against the pot's and 50/50's. Even if they were to see hundreds of thousands in fines- those amounts are nominal when talking state budgets. Usually- this is the result from a personal issue from a gov't official, or perhaps a complaint from a civilian in response to a problem they had with something else. (for example, some other organization loses a case on public gambling, then points to an example where gambling is overlooked in bowling alleys and cries unfair. The govt is forced to respond and follow suit- after all, it is illegal to gamble in public). When people get used to it- the pot winners and 50/50 winners will just be recorded manually, and prizes given at a later date. Takes some of the fun out of it, but everything adapts.

NY in this instance, is just following suit to what NJ started. Contrary to rumor- not all locations were given fines in NJ. And, depending on the league 50/50's are still permisseable. (for example, one of my league's is run by a not for profit organization- where 50/50's are a legitimate way to raise funds, and are completely legal). If the state tried to stop us or fine the alley- they would be in a losing proposition (according to our lawyers, anyhow) We stopped ours of out respect for the owners of the lanes, they are paranoid- so it's not necessary for us to push the issue there when we can do it off site.