wierd rotation on black widow solid

[hbhammerhead]

i'm trying to help my friend get better, so we can join a league as a team this summer and i'm not a coach by any means so i need some help.

okay first...when you throw a bowlng ball with white or brightly colored finger grips you can see how they roll on the lane.

my friend is left handed and when he throws his black widow solid his finger grips go in a circle and you can see them all the way down the lane. he has low revs and med speed. when i throw (i'm right handed) my finger grips start around 5/6 o' clock rotate up and disappear around 10-11 o'clock and start over again. my best guess is that he is getting his hand too much on the side of the ball and not under and behind. anyways, his ball is not finishing properly and i know that has something to do with that weird spin and his rev rate being low but even on dry lanes the ball does not move much. he uses a robby's revs wrist support and his ball is 13lbs. i don't have a picture of the drill but i will try to get one asap. thanks.

[hbhammerhead]

http://www.buddiesproshop.com/product/3905/Hammer_No_Mercy_Bowling_Ball.htm

to give you a better idea what i'm talking about. my rotation looks close to this guys. at one point on the roll the finger grips disappear on the back side of the ball. my friends grips never disappear and he doesn't have a high rev rate, so i can see what's happening the entire length of the lane. it's something weird that i have never seen before. they just go in a circle. if anyone can help me figure out the reason why this is happening i would really appreciate it. thanks.

[ghc83]

its sounds to me like hes coming around the front of the ball instead of up the side and its causing a "spin"...now im not a coach either but i have seen a lot of people do this...

[Rowdy]

He's throwing a "spinner". Common. There's nothing YOU can do. A coach on the other hand.......

[hbhammerhead]

well here is the thing. the ball is not even really rotating. it's like gliding. it seriously looks like its wobbling down the lane. picture the finger grips facing you and they just do a circle motion until it hits the back end and then it starts to roll. the weird thing is that he has a cherry vibe and it's like he is a completely different bowler. i know that i can't help him cause i've tried. that's why i am asking you guys because most people here have more experience then me.

are you referring to spinning as the finger grips making a horizontal orbit?

[ghc83]

thats pretty much what im talking about..next time he throws it look at where the oil track is...if its around the bottom of the ball or somewhere close to it..i dont think its the ball..it could be the way he releases it..like i said before im not a coach or anything close to it..lol

[hbhammerhead]

ya im sure it's the way he is releasing it. next time i go with him i will look to see where the oil is at.

[Stampy79]

Yea, sounds like he is flipping it. Thumb down and not rolling it. And there is something you can do for him. Just encourage him to stay behind it and show him how. I have done this with many people. First tell him that it takes a bit of time and humility, then walk him to the line and have him roll the ball with no approach , just let it go with maybe one step. Just keep doing that for a while until he gets used to the feel. Tell him to feel the ball on the palm of his hand. It should roll off the hand not drop off. You can help him, just take your time and it will all work. A good picture in his mind should be to lead with the pinky finger. Make that come through first. That should keep his hand behind it. But most important, keep encouraging him. These are the people we seem to lose to this game, because it takes practice and thats not cheap nowdays not to mention its frustrating :D

[Stampy79]

by the way, make sure he has a good fit with his ball too ! Sometimes if you cant get out of a ball, it will make you do weird things !

[hbhammerhead]

thanks for the advice stampy. i will pass it on to him and see if we can't fix this problem. he just got the black widow and cherry vibe so i'm trying to keep on encouraging him and offering my help so he doesn't feel like he'll never get it. oh and i hear you on the cost and frustration factor too. we always try to go together, so we can split the cost in half. :D

[bluerrpilot]

Full rollers will show the fingers as the ball goes down the lane. And they also have a funky release. There hand spins and usally the thumb and fingers come out of the ball at the same time.

[hbhammerhead]

Full rollers will show the fingers as the ball goes down the lane. And they also have a funky release. There hand spins and usally the thumb and fingers come out of the ball at the same time.

i think that it's a good possibility that he is releasing fingers and thumb at the same time. he is not very strong and that's why he is throwing a 13lb ball. it's weird though because when he throws the vibe it's a completely different looking roll, in fact it's better and he does get a better reaction from the ball.

[Rowdy]

Well,gosh and gee whiz,first the ball is spinning,now it glides,fingers on top,fingers to the side....hell,I don't know what else is going on. Does he drop the ball,too? Some video of this swing sure would help.

[hbhammerhead]

i will try to get some video soon. we went last night to practice and i noticed he wasn't getting that "weird" looking ball when he was relaxed. he has a big problem with his mental game and i keep encouraging him to just relax and have fun. i think next time i'll have him drink a few beers before we bowl. i keep telling him that it takes a lot of hard work and practice to get the results he wants.

[Stampy79]

Hey Rowdy, you ever get PM's asking for advise ? With your attitude I highly doubt it ! Geesh man, lighten up a bit. You sure come off as a grouch on most of your replies ! As a matter of fact, I think I will just let you handle all the questions in here. You seem to know more about bowling than anyone ! (1970's Style)

[Rowdy]

All the time,Stampy. I only speak the truth. As far as the '70's style, I got rid of all my '70's gear in the '80's. I can hold my own on the lanes. As far as the "lighten up" part, you might want to take your own advice. Play nice now.

[hbhammerhead]

oh and another problem he is having is that his arm swing is very tense and is hardly constant. are there any exercises that he could do at home to help get a consistent, loose arm swing?