What does it take to be a coach?

[can-ham]

So for the second time in a few years I've been approached to become a youth coach. I'm pretty sure this isn't because of my bowling knowledge or ability as I feel I need a coach, I'm sure it's more about my positive attitude and being able to relate to kids (or used to as I was involved in a snowboard skateboard shop for 10 years) .Currently I have no extra time but in the next few years when my kids are old enough and if they are (still) interested in bowling I think it might be a great idea.

Main problem is I believe the coaching training here is a joke, I've been screaming for a coach for the last 4 years and I just found out that 5 bowlers in my league have certification and to be honest I wouldn't trust any of them to coach me.

I think I would need to try and do some training/certification in the States. I noticed that their is also an online course which might be a more cost effective way to achieve level 1. Has anyone taken the online course. Or dose anyone have suggestions or recommendations about getting involved in coaching?

[idlehourlegend]

So for the second time in a few years I've been approached to become a youth coach. I'm pretty sure this isn't because of my bowling knowledge or ability as I feel I need a coach, I'm sure it's more about my positive attitude and being able to relate to kids (or used to as I was involved in a snowboard skateboard shop for 10 years) .Currently I have no extra time but in the next few years when my kids are old enough and if they are (still) interested in bowling I think it might be a great idea.

Main problem is I believe the coaching training here is a joke, I've been screaming for a coach for the last 4 years and I just found out that 5 bowlers in my league have certification and to be honest I wouldn't trust any of them to coach me.

I think I would need to try and do some training/certification in the States. I noticed that their is also an online course which might be a more cost effective way to achieve level 1. Has anyone taken the online course. Or dose anyone have suggestions or recommendations about getting involved in coaching?

Coaching training isnt just a joke there believe me, atleast here locally, out of the 3 local houses there are probably 20 coaches that I have either been coached by or watched coach and they all know absolutely nothing, most are bronze coaches and just have no idea what there doing with the kids because they only know how to teach things one way, so when a kid is unique they dont know how to teach it. Also they usually tend to go to the kids that are better bowlers and usually the kids are better bowlers than the coaches around here. Most of the kids here wont listen to the coaches at all. Basically the bronze certification is like the kindergarten of bowling, you learn all of the basics and thats really about it, then these coaches that have the bronze cert. walk around like they know everything about the sport of bowling and cant teach anyone and make them better, when they really just know the basics. Most of these people just know the information that they had to read in the books for the cert. and thats it. Now I am not saying this is for all the people or anything like that but its for all of them around here in this area that I know of.

[Lonewolf300800]

Coaching takes a very special type of person. You can have all the "training" and certification you can get and still not be a good coach as Can-ham and Idle have witnessed. If you cannot properly communicate with someone what you are trying to teach them, they will not learn and perhaps become frustrated. Having a good relationship and being able to communicate is to me is more important than any "training" that a person may have. Can-ham, if you have a good relationship with the kids and they are willing to listen to you, by all means work with them a little and show them the joys of the sport. You don't have to try to turn them into excellant bowlers overnight, just give them the benefit of your time; that's the most valuable thing you can give them, your time. Idle, I hope you continue to carry on and not take to long a break from bowling if that's what you decide to do. If I'm mistaken please correct me, but you do use the two-handed method of delivering the ball do you not? I know it's not a new technique, but definately coaching for this style is way behind. To some who've never seen this style, being asked to coach a bowler learning this style can prove daunting. I do believe however, that eventually this style will be better understood and coaching will become more readily prevelant. It all comes down to communication, if you can communicate what you are trying to teach someone in terms that they can understand they will thank you for it by the bright smile that lights up their face.

[idlehourlegend]

Coaching takes a very special type of person. You can have all the "training" and certification you can get and still not be a good coach as Can-ham and Idle have witnessed. If you cannot properly communicate with someone what you are trying to teach them, they will not learn and perhaps become frustrated. Having a good relationship and being able to communicate is to me is more important than any "training" that a person may have. Can-ham, if you have a good relationship with the kids and they are willing to listen to you, by all means work with them a little and show them the joys of the sport. You don't have to try to turn them into excellant bowlers overnight, just give them the benefit of your time; that's the most valuable thing you can give them, your time. Idle, I hope you continue to carry on and not take to long a break from bowling if that's what you decide to do. If I'm mistaken please correct me, but you do use the two-handed method of delivering the ball do you not? I know it's not a new technique, but definately coaching for this style is way behind. To some who've never seen this style, being asked to coach a bowler learning this style can prove daunting. I do believe however, that eventually this style will be better understood and coaching will become more readily prevelant. It all comes down to communication, if you can communicate what you are trying to teach someone in terms that they can understand they will thank you for it by the bright smile that lights up their face.


Yes Lone, I use the 2 handed technique and am the only person around here that does. I personally wasnt talking about the coaching towards me, but towards the other kids, when I bowled in youth leagues for 2 years I never had coaches help me or anything, I basically taught myself how to bowl the whole way through and learned things by expierience over time. But towards the other kids they were just telling them to do things that they should not do, one kid throws the ball well but has a little hard time with his approach, instead of working on that the one coach started trying to get him to throw the ball left handed. Some of the things they do is just rediculous. I use to go on Sat.'s and help some of the kids and do some coaching and most of them wanted my help because I can relate to them and have more knowledge and more easy fixes to things than the coaches did. Had my gf's average go from 170 to 203 over just the summer of work, bowling 40-60 games a week together. Its about wanting to have the drive to work and get the help you need and be willing to listen. Having the knowledge to be a coach isnt about having a piece of paper that says your a USBC certified coach or being able to read 2 books on bowling and then take a test on them, its about bowling expierience and being able to fix problems within peoples games and learning how to get them to trust you and listen to what you have to say.

The USBC is starting to do studies on the 2 handed technique and many of the coaches are trying to get information together by watching the games of Jason Belmonte and Osku Palermaa and Cassidy Schaub was involved too if Im not mistaken, they picked out parts of each persons games that made them unique and made the style work well for them and I guess now they are going to start trying to come up with ways to teach it. What they dont realize is that this style really cannot be "taught", all of us (myself, Osku, Jason, Cassidy, even young Chaz Dennis from Ohio) grew up bowling at 2-3 years old, back then the ball is too heavy so you throw it 2 handed, then you grow up and keep throwing 2 hands, then you put an approach to it and get good. If you dont start doing it early and just try and learn it off the top of your head instead of it coming naturally to you, your not going to be able to do it well. With all of us and all of the good 2 handers it came naturally, most of us taught ourselves to bowl and just always threw a ball like that. It wasnt something we learned and IMO really cant be learned. I hope I am wrong, but its JMO from reading about all of the other 2 handers.

As for me taking a long period off, I will always be on here to help everyone, I am just taking the summer off from bowling and getting healthy again (long story).

Sorry for the somewhat off topic post, Can.

[Lonewolf300800]

Thanks Idle for all you do to help the kids with their bowling. I agree with everything you said, you have to have more than a piece of paper to be a good coach, you have to have the heart and the communication skills to be succesful. I've worked with a few people myself and it's always a great feeling when you see them improve, and that big smile on their faces is a bonus. I also agree Idle, that the two handed technique is more a self-taught style at the moment. Hopefully, in the future this style may be able to be succesfully taught, but time will tell.

Can-ham, if you have the chance to make a difference in some kids lives by showing them the joys in bowling please do so.

[idlehourlegend]

Thanks Idle for all you do to help the kids with their bowling. I agree with everything you said, you have to have more than a piece of paper to be a good coach, you have to have the heart and the communication skills to be succesful. I've worked with a few people myself and it's always a great feeling when you see them improve, and that big smile on their faces is a bonus. I also agree Idle, that the two handed technique is more a self-taught style at the moment. Hopefully, in the future this style may be able to be succesfully taught, but time will tell.

Can-ham, if you have the chance to make a difference in some kids lives by showing them the joys in bowling please do so.

I agree, its very gratifying to see that all of the work you do with someone pays off and they start showing improvement and start putting up big scores, exactly like you said the smile on there face is payment for all of the work. It's great to be able to pass down the information we learn over the years to the younger kids and hopefully they will take what they learn and pass it on to more kids.

I agree Can, if you have the chance to make a difference and get kids interested in something like bowling instead of being on the streets etc. definately dont let that oppurtunity pass you by.

[TKelly]

I help out coach in our house youth leagues Fri and Sat. I don't have any certs. of any type but was asked by the house owners if I'd help out. I'm there with my kids so why not. I have the basic knowledge of the game and the kids relate to me I guess cause I don't intimidate them our talk over their heads. One thing I can say is repetition...and patience...even with parents who question why your teaching them to do a certain thing. I like to start them out near the foul line swing the ball back and step with slide foot and release then build the approach backwards I guess,do this over 2-3 sessions. I try not to over whem them otherwise if they try to think about it all, they toss gutters and then don't want to do it anymore. I've had good success this season with most of the kids I've done this with. Some don't want help at first but after they see ya help someone else and then see them starting to do better they come around. I've even had kids now come ask if they can bowl with me when I practice. Nice Feeling... I've run into parents that don't want you to help their kids cause they said they'll do it on their own.How when they don't even bowl themselves is beyond me so I don't bother. I had one parent tell their child "don't listen to him he doesn't know what he's doing" after i gave them something to try out, so I don't coach them anymore and they are still struggling while the others I've helped are getting better. I think their parents feel like clowns now cause I know one of the other parents whose child I help keeps saying around them how well their child is doing with my help and continued support.
So I guess I'll look into getting certified at some point,I'd really like it if the house I'm at would pick up the cost they have 3 certified on staff, 2 bronze,1 silver, so if I can show the dedication this season then it may be possible in the future.. If not then I just go like I am and help out whereever I can. It's fun and rewarding...

[slap]

Basically the bronze certification is like the kindergarten of bowling, you learn all of the basics and thats (sic) really about it,

Really, when did you take the course or otherwise had the opportunity to read the coursework material? Assuming you haven't, how do you know what is taught?

[idlehourlegend]

Really, when did you take the course or otherwise had the opportunity to read the coursework material? Assuming you haven't, how do you know what is taught?

My girlfriends dad took the course and gave me the books to read(bronze), didnt gain hardly anything out of what I already knew reading the books. Figured some coach would come on here and have a problem with it, I commend you for the work you do with the kids and I know you have a lot more knowledge than what the books teach Sammy, but a lot of these guys that go to these courses think that when they come out that they know more than anyone anywhere, and that everything they read in those books has to be the only way to do things and that there way is the only right way. My gf's dad is that way, everything he read from that book is like set in stone and the book to him can like never be wrong and theres like no other learning to him outside of whats in those books, thinks everything about bowling is in there. Thats how a lot of people are with it. But as we both know there is tons that those books dont cover. Was just saying my opinion, reading articles online and going through all the the adjustments and everything on your own first hand is a lot more important than reading it in a book. Exactly why I would rather take advice from someone 50 years old rather than a 20 year old silver certified USBC coach, 9/10 of the time. I am not saying all coaches are like this and I said in my previous posts that some coaches are very good but the ones around here locally both bronze and silver coaches are horrendous in this area.

[slap]

So for the second time in a few years I've been approached to become a youth coach. I'm pretty sure this isn't because of my bowling knowledge or ability as I feel I need a coach, I'm sure it's more about my positive attitude and being able to relate to kids (or used to as I was involved in a snowboard skateboard shop for 10 years) .Currently I have no extra time but in the next few years when my kids are old enough and if they are (still) interested in bowling I think it might be a great idea.

Main problem is I believe the coaching training here is a joke, I've been screaming for a coach for the last 4 years and I just found out that 5 bowlers in my league have certification and to be honest I wouldn't trust any of them to coach me.

I think I would need to try and do some training/certification in the States. I noticed that their is also an online course which might be a more cost effective way to achieve level 1. Has anyone taken the online course. Or dose anyone have suggestions or recommendations about getting involved in coaching?

For me Mo Pinel summarized coaching in his See it, Feel it Do it manual

"Coaching is about what right feels like, and looks like, Not about what you're doing wrong. Coaching is about attention to detail!"

In my own words, coaching is about the desire to learn continuously and the skill of critical observation combined with the patience to explain in detail. Training through the USBC, Ritger and other systems builds the coaches mind by introducing concepts and teaching methods. A good coach will always seek more knowledge. The coaches "eye" and ability to effectively explain concepts is developed by working with students.

If you have any other questions send me a PM.

[Flessan]

I also coach our junior bowlers on Saturdays.. Some of which can outbowl me periodically... Most of the time, after the "league" session, Some of the kids will stay with me and bowl some more.
I try to stay open-minded while coaching, always wanting to learn more myself.

I'm not officially certified by any means. I have taken the Brunswick on-line beginning coaching class, which was common sense to me...

I'll have to pick up that Mo Pinel manual sometime, it sounds very educating.

[can-ham]

For me Mo Pinel summarized coaching in his See it, Feel it Do it manual

"Coaching is about what right feels like, and looks like, Not about what you're doing wrong. Coaching is about attention to detail!"

In my own words, coaching is about the desire to learn continuously and the skill of critical observation combined with the patience to explain in detail. Training through the USBC, Ritger and other systems builds the coaches mind by introducing concepts and teaching methods. A good coach will always seek more knowledge. The coaches "eye" and ability to effectively explain concepts is developed by working with students.

If you have any other questions send me a PM.


Thanks guys, great advice here. Slap this sounds like great place to start. As I mentioned I'm probably not going to get involved for a few years but in the mean time it wouldn't hurt to get prepared so I'm going to start with this book.

[ashley1_scott]

We have about 10 phase 1 ( your bronze level) coaches in are bowling alley,
most of them only took the course because their kids are in the YBC.
I have been asked by a lot of parents if i can coach their kids, i dont have a bit of paper to say that i can so i spoke to one of the coaches.
I was told that as i have no certifacate any knowledge that i have was useless.
So i went down the alley on a friday night ( this is when the ybc have their coaching night with the kids) and got the lane next to them.
I put up a bit of paper saying that i could give advice but NOT COACH, i had must of the kids bowling better and enjoying the game within the couple of hours i was allowed the lane for.
As you can guess this did not go down to well with the 'coach' who is a phase 1
http://btbca.co.uk/Frameset.htm
in fact he said that if i continued to disrupt his teaching he would get me barred from the alley, yes i did stop doing it.
he believes that he is a better coach than me because he paid the £85 to get the bit of paper.

[slap]

Thanks guys, great advice here. Slap this sounds like great place to start. As I mentioned I'm probably not going to get involved for a few years but in the mean time it wouldn't hurt to get prepared so I'm going to start with this book.

I wouldn't pay a lot for the book, there are better books for the money. However it appears on ebay from time to time.

We have about 10 phase 1 ( your bronze level) coaches in are bowling alley,
most of them only took the course because their kids are in the YBC.
I have been asked by a lot of parents if i can coach their kids, i dont have a bit of paper to say that i can so i spoke to one of the coaches.
I was told that as i have no certifacate any knowledge that i have was useless.
So i went down the alley on a friday night ( this is when the ybc have their coaching night with the kids) and got the lane next to them.
I put up a bit of paper saying that i could give advice but NOT COACH, i had must of the kids bowling better and enjoying the game within the couple of hours i was allowed the lane for.
As you can guess this did not go down to well with the 'coach' who is a phase 1
http://btbca.co.uk/Frameset.htm
in fact he said that if i continued to disrupt his teaching he would get me barred from the alley, yes i did stop doing it.
he believes that he is a better coach than me because he paid the £85 to get the bit of paper.

It looks like our current Bronze level is closer to your phase 2 or 3.

[Lefty]

Idle Tim is good coach right?

[J_W73]

We have about 10 phase 1 ( your bronze level) coaches in are bowling alley,
most of them only took the course because their kids are in the YBC.
I have been asked by a lot of parents if i can coach their kids, i dont have a bit of paper to say that i can so i spoke to one of the coaches.
I was told that as i have no certifacate any knowledge that i have was useless.
So i went down the alley on a friday night ( this is when the ybc have their coaching night with the kids) and got the lane next to them.
I put up a bit of paper saying that i could give advice but NOT COACH, i had must of the kids bowling better and enjoying the game within the couple of hours i was allowed the lane for.
As you can guess this did not go down to well with the 'coach' who is a phase 1
http://btbca.co.uk/Frameset.htm
in fact he said that if i continued to disrupt his teaching he would get me barred from the alley, yes i did stop doing it.
he believes that he is a better coach than me because he paid the £85 to get the bit of paper.


If you have the knowledge and are an effective coach then a piece of paper doesn't mean squat. I wouldn't stop doing what you are doing unless there is some sort of law against it in your neck of the woods.

[idlehourlegend]

Idle Tim is good coach right?

Yes he is, very good coach and Tim really truely knows everything he's talking about. But to my knowledge, Tim didnt go to USBC courses, he learned it all through expierience and bowling through the years, IMO thats the type of person you want to go to. Someone that has went through all of it and knows different ways to fix everything that is wrong, Tim has always gave me great tips on how to fix things, most were simple and fixed things very fast.

[TenPinSniper]

Gonna agree the paper or certificate is only as good as the person who holds it.

If the coach it out there reading and always trying to learn new things that might work for bowlers, then that coach is probably going to be good. But if the set on one method or approach to the game, then aviod them like the plague.

Certificates generally show the person cared enough to take time to further their knowledge, these course are good. But you still have to gain the trust and be able to apply things learned.

A good coach won't force one style of play on the bowler, they adapt to help that bowler progress and become better with their style of play.